Comments on: Demons

By: Lynn

Lynn — Wed, 27 Aug 2008 00:10:32 +0000

Angels is simply a messenger and flesh and blood humans are usually the case. Yes there are celestial angel messengers also. Here we have 2 Peter 2:4 that speaks of messengers of God that went to the grave for sin. For we know that the wages of sin is death that has to be paid. Your point is that this is celestial beings that God didn’t spare but there isn’t any thing written here to prove they were celestial messengers and not human ones.

2 Peter 2:4 talks of wicked people going to Tartarus(translated hell in many versions). Tartarus was a mythical place in the underworld; yet Peter does not correct that notion but rather uses it as a symbol of complete destruction and punishment for sin. Christ’s use of the word Gehenna was similar.

Jude 6 ( verse 7 is self explainied that fornication was the reason for their destruction and I am not going to even explain that) has an interesting thought for you to think about..The devil is chained in Rev 20 but he and his angels were chained in Genesis, according to the common view of Jude 6. If he was bound with “eternal chains” then, how is he chained up again in Rev 20?

From this it should be obvious that the popular view that the devil was cast out of heaven for sinning cannot be true, seeing that he is described as still being in heaven after each occurrence of being ‘cast out’. It is vital to understand both heaven and hell and the devil in a figurative sense.

If something was put into ever lasting chains, what does ever-lasting mean? Period of time or forever?

In the time of Adam and Eve there were created people outside the garden that were not given instructions as Adam was. These are referred to as Mankind. Adam was the first son of God and his descendants were the sons of God. Adam’s linage mixed with other people and God destroyed them and found only Noah as PURE BLOODED. Anything being taught or suggested by rabbis should be approached with extreme caution. Rabbis are not God’s people.

By: Steve Welch

Steve Welch — Mon, 25 Aug 2008 12:44:11 +0000

Lynn, I cannot agree with your above statements. Scripture has too many references to the fact that, Angels were indeed able to sin and that, some of them did sin. 2Peter and Jude6-7 verify that.

“sons of God” or B’nai haElohim in Hebrew, used also (and only) in Job 1:6, 2:1 & 38:7 – the term always refers to angels. Only this passage from Genesis is debated because of the disturbing nature of this topic. Many competent and prominent Bible scholars of today believe the “sons of God” are of human lineage. This has been taught in seminaries for years, but was not the understanding of the early church, nor even the position of many modern Rabbis. Ultimately, this position simply does not “hold water” under even casual study.

2 Peter 2: 4-6

“For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; 5) And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eight person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly, 6) And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an example unto those that after should live ungodly…” KJV

“For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell*, putting them into gloomy dungeons* to be held for judgment; if he did not spare the ancient world when he brought the flood on its ungodly people, but protected Noah, a preacher of righteousness, and seven others; if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly…”
*Greek Tartarus *Or into chains of darkness (NIV Study notes)

Jude 6-7

“6) And the angels which kept not their * first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved * in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7) Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.”
* original place with God
* in prison (KJV notes on alternate meanings of these phrases)

By: Lynn

Lynn — Sun, 24 Aug 2008 20:37:28 +0000

During the time of Job, men that were of high authority were the ones that went into the tabernacles and spoke to YHWH. Someone that was jealous of Job yet was a priest also went to YHWH and asked that YHWH do the things that were done. The descendants of the chosen line were referred to as sons of God. These were not angels. How if a disobedient angel( saying that it is even possible they can be disobedient) was cast out of heaven be able to return? It was inside the tabernacle and by a man that these things came upon Job because God knew Job’s outcome. The sons of God were the leaders of the tabernacle and the adversary jealous of Job was among them.

By: Steve Welch

Steve Welch — Sun, 24 Aug 2008 15:49:34 +0000

Question? Above you make mention of the Book Of Job. Job 1, starting at verse 6, talks about Satan, before God standing with the “sons of God”, i.e Angels. If Satan is not a “son of God”, then who is he?

Job 1; 6-9
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them.
7 The LORD said to Satan, “From where do you come?” Then Satan answered the LORD and said, From roaming about on the earth and walking around on it.”
8 The LORD said to Satan, “Have you considered My servant Job? For there is no one like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, fearing God and turning away from evil.”
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, “Does Job fear God for nothing?